[3.11] Shaper = Stunned, Tidebreaker Heavy Strike Stunner Build

I haven't been playing for a long time. Please explain what are these blood and sand stances? Isn't they only for gladiator ascendancy?

It's one of the new gems introduced with 3.7 - you can look it up here: https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/2514087 (top row, third from the right)
Gladiator Ascendancy just got some things to work with those stances, but you have to change/use them by gem.

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Crujien escribió:

It's one of the new gems introduced with 3.7 - you can look it up here: https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/2514087 (top row, third from the right)
Gladiator Ascendancy just got some things to work with those stances, but you have to change/use them by gem.

Thanks for the answer.

But we have Maim support skill wich cause maimed enemies to take 14% increased phys dmg. And we have Flesh and stone aura wich also cause maim effect and enemies take 16% increased phys dmg. I dont't think that we can maim one enemy with both maim effects (getting 14% + 16% incr phys dmg) at the same time. But we will see how it works in the game later.

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dtk92892 escribió:

2h sword viable ?

It certainly can be viable. You will need to invest into Sword nodes instead of Mace ones, and you will need to make sure you get all the general r.E.S.T. to compensate for not having Tidebreaker. It's going to be harder to stun Shaper but it can have other advantages as well.

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Shrie escribió:

Or if you just run Vigilant Strike + Increased Duration for 15.36 sec fortify or if you wanna get nuts sacrifice a jewel slot and run the vigil. Give you and all your friends a 46 second fortify. The fortify cluster is very good imo. 44% damage and 16% attack speed not even mentioning the 4% less damage taken, 5% movement speed, or minor fortify duration buff.

Pride + War Banner + Flesh and Stone is mobs taking 76% increased physical damage (more if you plant the banner). I think I will be going pure physical this league. Not to mention Flesh and Stone is very nice Defenses while in sand stance if you just wanted your totem to maim...

Heavy Strike - MPD - Ruthless - Bloodlust - Brutality - Stun/DoFL/Multi/Fortify

I am not sure if Brutality is worth it. Even while using Pride we can still get tons of damage from flasks, which are elemental and chaos damage. I need to do some careful calculations before reaching a conclusion here.

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Tecken1407 escribió:

Try change ruthless to impale, impale seems alot stronger than it?

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Crujien escribió:

Vulnerability (20% chance) should actually be enough to bleed. Better save that gem socket for something else.
Also, i would take Flesh and Stone (Blood Stance; Enemies Maimed By This Skill Take 16% Increased Physical Damage) over Herald of Purity.
You might also want to swap Brutality for either Ruthless / Multistrike in your setup. Having Taste of Hate / Atziri's Promise / %phys as chaos amulet is simply way better than having pure phys through Brutality.

I'd also really like some thoughts on Impale. With the new support gem and investing into the (very nearby) Impale nodes in tree we can easily reach 90% chance to impale and 89% increased effect on it. That should add up on ~100%+ MORE damage overall - which would further increase stuns/stunchance , right? (Brutality could be better at this point; also, when swapping out Ruthless for Impale that should mean more consistency overall)
Really need some insight on this one.

Vulnerability, if you want to bleed Shaper then he only takes 33% (not sure) of curse effectiveness, making the 20% chance to bleed down to 6-7%. Then it's no longer enough. Normal bosses also only take 67%? (not sure) of curse effect.

Impale is calculated separately and cannot help with stunning. Because we hit pretty slowly it's almost impossible to see great actual DPS from impale. Mobs will just die right after we apply enough stacks of impale on them.

I know about Impale being it's own damage source/instance, but have a look at the following calculation:

We get 90% Impale chance from tree/support.
We get 89% increased effect of impale from tree/support.
Using Dread Banner adds another 20% chance and 19% effect. 110% chance, 108% effect in total.

Now, our first hit would do 100% damage with no impale stacks on enemy.
Second hit would do 100% (normal hit) + 20,8% (including increased effect) from one impale stack in two seperate source/instances.
Third hit does 100% + 41,6% from two impale stacks - again, in two sources/instances.
...
Sixth hit onwards deals 100% + 104% from impale.

So, while saying Impale does not help the initial hit on stun chance is true, we get double the hits/chances/sources running after the sixth hit.

Also i don't really understand your argument with mobs dieing before we stack this up. Normal/Rare mobs will be dead by the first or second hit anyway and on bosses the stacking will be up after the first second in combat (another plus: no decaying when you need to move - impale stacks have no timer). So as far as you don't kill bosses within <10 hits, this should be worth after all.

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Crujien escribió:

I know about Impale being it's own damage source/instance, but have a look at the following calculation:

We get 90% Impale chance from tree/support.
We get 89% increased effect of impale from tree/support.
Using Dread Banner adds another 20% chance and 19% effect. 110% chance, 108% effect in total.

Now, our first hit would do 100% damage with no impale stacks on enemy.
Second hit would do 100% (normal hit) + 20,8% (including increased effect) from one impale stack in two seperate source/instances.
Third hit does 100% + 41,6% from two impale stacks - again, in two sources/instances.
...
Sixth hit onwards deals 100% + 104% from impale.

So, while saying Impale does not help the initial hit on stun chance is true, we get double the hits/chances/sources running after the sixth hit.

Also i don't really understand your argument with mobs dieing before we stack this up. Normal/Rare mobs will be dead by the first or second hit anyway and on bosses the stacking will be up after the first second in combat (another plus: no decaying when you need to move - impale stacks have no timer). So as far as you don't kill bosses within <10 hits, this should be worth after all.

I am actually not so sure if Impale works this way. Impales are separate debuffs dealing reflection damage themselves. So there is a possibility that each instance is calculated separately instead of collectively. There is also a possibility that our r.E.S.T. won't work because for example Skull Cracking says "10% reduced enemy stun threshold with maces", and Impale may not be calculated as our mace damage. We need clarification on this mechanics before doing any math here.

Another comment is about the fluctuations in our damage. Our hits don't look like 100, 100, 100, 100, 100. Rather, it looks like 75, 50, 200, 100, 75. It isn't the hits dealing 50 that are stunning, it's the hits dealing 200 that are. So when you add up the Impales, you're essentially taking the average, and you cannot compare the average with the ones that actually stun the enemies.

Why do you chose slayer and Berserker for the build?

dont you think champion would be a great choice as well?

new impale looks promissing


Also, for HC which ascendency you think have best defences?

Great guide OP, but I'm also eagerly waiting for your refined thoughts about going crit, please keep us updated, thanks!

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SMOKALOT escribió:

Why do you chose slayer and Berserker for the build?

dont you think champion would be a great choice as well?

new impale looks promissing


Also, for HC which ascendency you think have best defences?

Champion is okay, so is Ascendant, even Jugg is fine as well.I used to have a Champion and an Ascendant section in the guide. I removed them recently because:

Champion is pretty slow, and it doesn't have the AoE and the leech from Slayer. The DPS from Champion is great but this build doesn't really need DPS. It's overall pretty solid with good DPS and defense but it lacks identity and a good reason to use over Slayer or Berserker. Also because our attack rate is pretty low, we cannot make very good use of the Impale mechanics.

Berserker is a lot faster than any other options here, and being fast alone is a good reason to pick Berserker. It can also pull out the best DPS - which with good gears, should be around 4M in 3.7.

Slayer has good DPS now, has good AoE bonuses, and has its signature leech. Before leech got nerfed in 3.6? People were picking Ascendant purely to get the Slayer leech.

I also removed the Ascendant version recently because it kind of lacks identity as well. Berserker is now faster than Ascendant and that's like the only thing Ascendant does well.

So I think Berserker and Slayer are the 2 choices this build really needs right now. Berserker is for the fast and high DPS high stun capability figure for the more aggressive types of people, and Slayer being more well-rounded with good defense and big AoE for the more central/defensive oriented.

EDIT: for HC, I would say Slayer for sure. It has enough damage so that you can go for all the life nodes in the tree, and it also has the leech and AoE which keep you safe.

Great job mate, cannot wait for all the info! Btw, how it's going to be with packs clearing? Will we use a new aoe gem? What about ms skills choices? Thx!