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Madcow1120 escribió:
What if you drop Heart of Oak path and Ballistic Mastery (not sure how much projec damage calculates) then use those 5 points to grab Revenge of the Hunted and Crusader?
lose
10 int
10 dex
4% life
30% chance to avoid being stunned
15% block and stun recovery
20% proj speed
20% proj damage
1% life regen
Gain
10 dex (so they cancel)
18% life
28% evasion
4% physical damage
18% physical damage with 1H melee weapons (this should work since it's 1H)
20 strength
So, more life and evasion and perhaps the physical damage increase may cancel the loss of projectile?
thoughts?
This build does basically 0 phys damage.
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Languidness escribió:
12k armor, 7k evasion. With no grace.
Can you list the rough stats I'd need from gear to achieve this? Sounds pretty impossible without hundreds of exalts to invest.
700 Eva from Alpha
1500 Armor from chest
1500 Eva from shield
200/200 Armor+Eva from gloves
200/200 Armor+Eva from boots
200 armor from belt
2600 total Eva -> 30%ish eva buff from dex -> 3380 eva
2100 total Armor -> 80%ish armor you said -> 3780 -> 90% or so from determination -> 7182 armor
This is with gear that would be considered beyond GG in Nemesis, easily multi exa per piece.
How exactly are you getting 12k armor and 7k eva? I'm getting about half of your numbers with a total gear setup that would cost dozens of exalts upon adding in WED/HP/AS/Resists where applicable.
84% armor, and you missed the 32% eva bonus from the armor/eva nodes.
Maybe I'm off on gear cost when comparing to nemesis. Perhaps you're right and going with grace and iron reflexes would be better. But, you're starting to require enough points that this build overall won't be viable. Chopping off the couple of aura effectiveness nodes that you already have is going to punish the build's performance quite a bit.
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Publicado porMorael#0083en 13 ene. 2014 12:43:29
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Morael escribió:
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Languidness escribió:
12k armor, 7k evasion. With no grace.
Can you list the rough gear I'd need from gear to achieve this? Sounds pretty impossible without hundreds of exalts to invest.
Alpha's, gloves with 400 ev, boots with 150 armor/eva, chest and shield with high armor and evasion to fit your needs (I leave this vague because there are lots of possibilities: 2k armor chest, 1.7k eva shield; 2k eva chest, 1.7k armor shield, or go with hybrid pieces). If you could get a belt with an armor roll, that certainly wouldn't hurt either.
My gear setup (which is fully linked on the previous page) with a 1.7k eva sheild would probably get me 11k armor/7k eva at the minimum, I don't know exactly because:
a. I don't have the shield
b. I need 2 more levels to get 32% armor/eva from the duelist area and I don't feel like hand calculating the numbers at the moment.
This build may be quoted as a cheap build, but I will say for sure... if you're trying to make it nemesis viable, it's not going to be cheap (because nothing is). On the same token, it certainly won't be that expensive.
Excluding my prism guardian, the rest of my setup cost me ~8 exalts max (It might be more like 7), and half of that was just for the damn alpha's.
Are you really trying to tell me what it takes to run on Nemesis when you have around 20 characters on Standard/Dom and not a single one in HC/Neme?
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Languidness escribió:
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Madcow1120 escribió:
What if you drop Heart of Oak path and Ballistic Mastery (not sure how much projec damage calculates) then use those 5 points to grab Revenge of the Hunted and Crusader?
lose
10 int
10 dex
4% life
30% chance to avoid being stunned
15% block and stun recovery
20% proj speed
20% proj damage
1% life regen
Gain
10 dex (so they cancel)
18% life
28% evasion
4% physical damage
18% physical damage with 1H melee weapons (this should work since it's 1H)
20 strength
So, more life and evasion and perhaps the physical damage increase may cancel the loss of projectile?
thoughts?
This build does basically 0 phys damage.
If you lose ballistic mastery, you need to make up the projectile speed elsewhere... which is going to cost you a lot (either an ammy slot, or your 6th gem in a now mandatory 6 link)
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Publicado porMorael#0083en 13 ene. 2014 12:44:57
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Morael escribió:
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Languidness escribió:
12k armor, 7k evasion. With no grace.
Can you list the rough stats I'd need from gear to achieve this? Sounds pretty impossible without hundreds of exalts to invest.
700 Eva from Alpha
1500 Armor from chest
1500 Eva from shield
200/200 Armor+Eva from gloves
200/200 Armor+Eva from boots
200 armor from belt
2600 total Eva -> 30%ish eva buff from dex -> 3380 eva
2100 total Armor -> 80%ish armor you said -> 3780 -> 90% or so from determination -> 7182 armor
This is with gear that would be considered beyond GG in Nemesis, easily multi exa per piece.
How exactly are you getting 12k armor and 7k eva? I'm getting about half of your numbers with a total gear setup that would cost dozens of exalts upon adding in WED/HP/AS/Resists where applicable.
84% armor, and you missed the 32% eva bonus from the armor/eva nodes.
Maybe I'm off on gear cost when comparing to nemesis. Perhaps you're right and going with grace and iron reflexes would be better. But, you're starting to require enough points that this build overall won't be viable. Chopping off the couple of aura effectiveness nodes that you already have is going to punish the build's performance quite a bit.
I'm not chopping any aura effectiveness nodes - that was a barebones model spec that hadn't been min-maxed. I'm chopping off Berserking ring - that's it. I end up with an armor spec instead of an eva spec, more HP, and less damage. This is what I want. Whether eva or armor is superior is arguable; I simply prefer armor.
But yes, your numbers are way off. I don't know how you're pulling 12k extra armor out of thin air with no losses.
Editado por útlima vez por Languidness#2416 en 13 ene. 2014 12:48:48
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Languidness escribió:
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Morael escribió:
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Languidness escribió:
12k armor, 7k evasion. With no grace.
Can you list the rough gear I'd need from gear to achieve this? Sounds pretty impossible without hundreds of exalts to invest.
Alpha's, gloves with 400 ev, boots with 150 armor/eva, chest and shield with high armor and evasion to fit your needs (I leave this vague because there are lots of possibilities: 2k armor chest, 1.7k eva shield; 2k eva chest, 1.7k armor shield, or go with hybrid pieces). If you could get a belt with an armor roll, that certainly wouldn't hurt either.
My gear setup (which is fully linked on the previous page) with a 1.7k eva sheild would probably get me 11k armor/7k eva at the minimum, I don't know exactly because:
a. I don't have the shield
b. I need 2 more levels to get 32% armor/eva from the duelist area and I don't feel like hand calculating the numbers at the moment.
This build may be quoted as a cheap build, but I will say for sure... if you're trying to make it nemesis viable, it's not going to be cheap (because nothing is). On the same token, it certainly won't be that expensive.
Excluding my prism guardian, the rest of my setup cost me ~8 exalts max (It might be more like 7), and half of that was just for the damn alpha's.
Are you really trying to tell me what it takes to run on Nemesis when you have around 20 characters on Standard/Dom and not a single one in HC/Neme?
Not at all. As I said in my other post, perhaps my numbers are off, I'm just going by my experience with the character I'm currently playing. I'm certain that my knowledge of gear prices is probably completely inaccurate for nemesis. But, I still question, if my version of the build going armor/eva won't work, do you think you can make it work with IR/armor alone?
I don't play HC/Nemesis out of time constraints.
Editado por útlima vez por Morael#0083 en 13 ene. 2014 14:36:11
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Publicado porMorael#0083en 13 ene. 2014 12:47:52
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Languidness escribió:
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Morael escribió:
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Languidness escribió:
12k armor, 7k evasion. With no grace.
Can you list the rough stats I'd need from gear to achieve this? Sounds pretty impossible without hundreds of exalts to invest.
700 Eva from Alpha
1500 Armor from chest
1500 Eva from shield
200/200 Armor+Eva from gloves
200/200 Armor+Eva from boots
200 armor from belt
2600 total Eva -> 30%ish eva buff from dex -> 3380 eva
2100 total Armor -> 80%ish armor you said -> 3780 -> 90% or so from determination -> 7182 armor
This is with gear that would be considered beyond GG in Nemesis, easily multi exa per piece.
How exactly are you getting 12k armor and 7k eva? I'm getting about half of your numbers with a total gear setup that would cost dozens of exalts upon adding in WED/HP/AS/Resists where applicable.
84% armor, and you missed the 32% eva bonus from the armor/eva nodes.
Maybe I'm off on gear cost when comparing to nemesis. Perhaps you're right and going with grace and iron reflexes would be better. But, you're starting to require enough points that this build overall won't be viable. Chopping off the couple of aura effectiveness nodes that you already have is going to punish the build's performance quite a bit.
I'm not chopping any aura effectiveness nodes - that was a barebones model spec that hadn't been min-maxed. I'm chopping off Berserking ring - that's it. I end up with an armor spec instead of an eva spec, more HP, and less damage. This is what I want. Whether eva or armor is superior is arguable; I simply prefer armor.
But yes, your numbers are way off. I don't know how you're pulling 12k extra armor out of thin air with no losses.
The build I looked at (the inner force/rogue areas one), you'd skipped 16% aura effectiveness up by Sovereignty.
Edit:
Also, I was forgetting about the Sentinel node in all of my calculations on the past couple of pages.
We took our little quarrel to PMs to not clutter up this thread anymore, sorry everyone.
But for the information to be out there:
Actual bonuses/amounts:
Armor: 24 + 30 + 10 + 12 + 8 + 24 = 108% armor (with my gear and a theoretical 150 armor belt, roughly 9.7k armor... I'm a little off. I think I was misremembering my armor snapshot with my low level Molten Shell procced?)
evasion: 24 + 8 + 24 + 215 dex (for simplicity, required for most high end foils, 43%) = 99% evasion. (with my gear and a theoretical 1700 eva shield, roughly 5.1k eva)
Editado por útlima vez por Morael#0083 en 13 ene. 2014 13:04:30
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Publicado porMorael#0083en 13 ene. 2014 12:51:33
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Yeah, if you could actually hit 12k armor and 7k eva, no shit it'd be superior to plain 12k armor. Except you can't - with realistic Nemeis gear you'd be hitting like 6k armor and 2k eva; might as well just go full armor with eva that low.
If you have like 20 characters, with many above 70, I don't think you can make the argument that you don't have time. The vast majority of Nemesis deaths have nothing to do with desync. There's nothing wrong with not playing on HC leagues; I just find your estimates of it somewhat unrealistic.
Anyways, we're beginning to derail the thread; we should get back on topic.
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The build I looked at (the inner force/rogue areas one), you'd skipped 16% aura effectiveness up by Sovereignty.
Was a simple model spec demonstrating the rough paths I was comparing, with some random nodes cut off here and there to bring them to the same point total, not final build. Sorry for lack of clarity.
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How would Elemental Equilibrium work with this build? Not sure the mechanics of that since we hit with all elements at once. Unless it gives the +25 to the strongest element and -50 to the rest.
I didn't see this discussed but could have missed it through 60 pages. Man, I wish you could search single topics rather than just the entire subforum.
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Languidness escribió:
This build does basically 0 phys damage.
ahh I was totally thinking of spectral throw using % from weapon. Forgot physical duh.
good build, up to level 80, I took Ondar's Guile and it works well enough. Need more life though. There is a nice cluster in that path I'll be grabbing. Pacific (GMT -8) Time Editado por útlima vez por Madcow1120#4324 en 13 ene. 2014 13:50:15
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