[3.5] The Blinding Blizzard - Whispering Ice CI Elequisitor - Viable For Everything

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Kelvynn escribió:

- Regen/recharge vs VP: not even close. VP leech is fantastic for tanking and cannot be replaced by regen/recharge. The closest those things came to VP was before the big ES nerf when somebody made a mirror-level Occultist with 30k ES or something like that, that could outregen T16 bosses. But it was all about ES and had crappy damage and took forever to kill anything serious.

With Vile Bastion you get 30% of your ES regenerated per second it is more than enough and saves you one gem slot and skill points to VP. And you can use Arakaali + Blood Rage + CWDT for even more regeneration rate.
Icestorm is not one heavy hit where you regain 3k HP in a second. Its damage is continuous so the regen takes longer than PoB states.

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Garfunkel escribió:

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Kelvynn escribió:

- Regen/recharge vs VP: not even close. VP leech is fantastic for tanking and cannot be replaced by regen/recharge. The closest those things came to VP was before the big ES nerf when somebody made a mirror-level Occultist with 30k ES or something like that, that could outregen T16 bosses. But it was all about ES and had crappy damage and took forever to kill anything serious.

With Vile Bastion you get 30% of your ES regenerated per second it is more than enough and saves you one gem slot and skill points to VP. And you can use Arakaali + Blood Rage + CWDT for even more regeneration rate.
Icestorm is not one heavy hit where you regain 3k HP in a second. Its damage is continuous so the regen takes longer than PoB states.

No no no, don't even mention vile bastion when we are talking about VP.
VP is NOT needed in map clearing. Generally speaking, we don't need leech entirely in map clearing. The only thing that worth consideration is tanking bosses, and there you will not get any of that regeneration from the vile bastion. Also, VP isn't blocking bastion's regeneration, so why not both? Even though we take it for flat ES and stun immunity...
Occultist's "Mini vaal discipline" is worth considering on bosses, but it's too clunky with that build, and doesn't suit its playstyle. (We still take it, of course, but it's not gonna be VP substitute)
Arakaali is worthy of mention, but it only 70%, and VP will grant 100% without even clunking our gem slots. If we can take both arakaali and VP - it's great... if only one of them - then it's definitely VP.

And i don't get your point about icestorm being not 1 great hit... Multiple small hits are actually better for leech rate. Check leech mechanic in wiki to understand why multiple hits are great, and one big hit isn't so.

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Garfunkel escribió:

With Vile Bastion you get 30% of your ES regenerated per second it is more than enough and saves you one gem slot and skill points to VP. And you can use Arakaali + Blood Rage + CWDT for even more regeneration rate.

You get 30% of your ES per second only on clear, if you are killing monsters. But this build is "good all around", so VP is better because bosses

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Garfunkel escribió:

Icestorm is not one heavy hit where you regain 3k HP in a second. Its damage is continuous so the regen takes longer than PoB states.

Thats better because watcher eye with correct mod gives us huge recovery, and there isnt a limit on how many leech instances can you have. There is limit on how much do you have total leech from all instances.

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pda898 escribió:

You get 30% of your ES per second only on clear, if you are killing monsters. But this build is "good all around", so VP is better because bosses

But VP was ok for Scion. For OCC start it is too far in the skilltree...

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Garfunkel escribió:

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pda898 escribió:

You get 30% of your ES per second only on clear, if you are killing monsters. But this build is "good all around", so VP is better because bosses

But VP was ok for Scion. For OCC start it is too far in the skilltree...

It's still ok for occ. Yeah, that would cost you about 4 additional skill points. Depends, it can be very well only 2, if you will be using fertile mind, instead of "pure talent" (Pure talent will be changed to something anyway, cause there is no way that we get to the templar start point). Whatever it is, VP is still worth it. Atleast for a fact that this build simply can't tank bosses at all without VP.

If build use leech to tank - it uses VP. No exceptions.

Well, if you are able to bring out 20% regen with the same investment of skill points, then yeah, that would be superior. But no luck, there is no way to do that.

Edit: by 20% regen, i mean without vile bastion, of course. Because it doesn't work in times when it's the most needed.

The new scorched ailment looks like it could increase the fire build damage even more. Worth watching to see what uniques it drops on and if they can be used in the build.

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Gythy escribió:

The new scorched ailment looks like it could increase the fire build damage even more. Worth watching to see what uniques it drops on and if they can be used in the build.

Helmet was already discussed

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Kelvynn escribió:

Could be useful for the fire version, depending on what Scorch is and how it works. If it's a fire debuff similar to Scorching Ray then it can replace Combustion (which it disables) and free up a socket.

But no Int and mediocre ES. I don't see it being better than a -resist fossil crafted Int helmet.

I was thinking about trying the Occultist version, but I have one concern: how 'pc-killing' is Icestorm nowadays? I played two or three different versions of this build and while I always loved it, last version I experienced was pretty spammy (Bestiary, I think). After playing PP VD I'd like to try something people won't hate me for.

is the cold Occultist version going to show up here or will it be a separate thread? cause that sounds like fun

I'm for sure going to do a cold version of this build. I'm leaning to Occultist as I love the idea of extra defenses. However, going from the Witch, the tree is a bit of a hot mess. Easy to underestimate the extra passives and starting position of the Scion.

Does anyone have a solid lvl 90 tree made for cold based Occultist?