[3.20] Ice Dancing Queen - Icestorm/Cyclone/CI - Viable For Everything

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Kelvynn escribió:

What I see so far (correct me if I'm wrong or missing something):


- New 'uber' (Awakened) versions of several support gems we are using. I haven't seen the stats yet, but they sound like the 'uber' gems mentioned in the 4.0 announcements that would be introduced at some point. They should be more powerful than the corrupted lv 21 gems. This is a buff, probably a significant one.

Biiiiig buffs: https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/2687774
Most damage supports get at least 5% more damage compared to old level 20 ones. Somehow I doubt anyone wants to +20% any of the old support gems anymore.
Special mention for CwC: it only takes 0.30 seconds per cast now, down from .35. That one is not only a big damage buff but QoL too.
Cold penetration with 42% pemetration is maybe better than controlled destruction that gives 5% more damage and some cast speed we cannot use.
Third new gem is blasphemy: 24% to curse against hexproof enemies and the biggie: +1 curses! Stun immunity we get from cyclone, +1 curses now from support gem. What is left for choosing occultist as ascendancy? We could switch to elementalist and get reflect immunity always, more penetration,
Maybe even a totally new ascendancy like raider for frenzy or pathfinder for better flasks, trickster for elusive.

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so hopefully more Golden Oils.

There never will be after a league has ended. Former league stuff will be more scarce always. Non-meta stuff could get cheaper, maybe, but golden oils will forever be in high demand by everyone since it either saves lots of skillpoints or gives great damage increases like for us.

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- Shaper bases are still avaialble

All shaper and elder stuff will be (much) more expensive. That sucks royally for both Watchers Eye and Cyclopean coil. I expect prices to ~double for both. Maybe more at the start.
Corrupting the belt will also be harder. We want to increase quality via catalyst for the belt to get more %int from corruption and more %allattr from the explicit. So now the belt has to be a perfect 15% explicit so we can get additional +3% %attr. The corruption has to be at least 5% for the same reason to get an improvement from catalysts at all. The upside of course is, this combined 4% increase exactly negate the nerf of losing 10-12% from chests and ammys. For the poor Astramentis users like me, it's even a buff :)

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- Shaper mod can be transferred to another item?

Can you point out where you read this? If this were true, it would trivialize much of crafting imho. Too good to be true by far.

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- No more 10-12% Inc Attr mod on Shaper Amu. But there is a new Catalyst crafting option that compensates for that.

No more 10-12% on chests either I think. Both of them can be partially compensated with catalyst quality: 20% improvement of a 9% base %attr gives you +1% from 1.8% rounded down as always.

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Graiaule escribió:

No. 15% max now, 20% quality makes it 18%. Corrupting THAT might give you 7% intel, for a total of 25%. Definitely you'll get 6% at least, for a 24% total.

No, if you are "unlucky" and hit the 4% corruption, you get nothing from catalyst quality.
Has to be a 5-6% corruption.

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Kelvynn escribió:

Going to play Icestorm again. This time of the year is always super busy for me, I play December leagues very casually.

Ah at long last i found you !!!

Youre Santa claus. Thats is why youre so busy in Dezember :-)

Nice to see, that you play this league. And if you come around to germany with your carriage make a short stop in my town.

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HHLupus escribió:

Can you point out where you read this? If this were true, it would trivialize much of crafting imho. Too good to be true by far.

Ctrl+F the patchnotes for Awakener's Orb. it's in Major New Content and Features

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Added new currency: Awakener's Orb. This item can be used on any item with influence (such as a Shaper-influenced Ring), and then any item of the same type (a ring in this case) to transfer that influence to the new item. The original item will be destroyed as a result of this process, but some of the original item's mods may be carried over to the destination item. An item can have two Influence types attached to it if they are transferred in this way.

I don't think we gain anything from having Shaper+Elder on a single item. A lot of the Elder stuff seemed to be Strength, Fire, Physical, or Chaos-based when I looked. I could have overlooked something though.

No doubt an item this strong will be rare, and thus expensive. And the fact that it can bring a mod over with it is just straight busted. I play Icestorm in Standard and I'm hoping to get one of these orbs and bring it back to Standard to transfer the Increased Intelligence mod to my armor:


The fact that it says "may" be carried over is a little worrisome, though. Will it only carry Shaper/Elder mods? Is it a dice roll if it carries any at all? I'm just going to wait and see.

This helps with base prices, e.g. instead of a lvl 86 hundreds of ex stygian vise elder belt, you can take an orb and use a cheapo normal 20c stygian vise to make it elder.

Probably of very limited use if at all for us: the orb itself is certainly not cheap and the difference from shaper vs. normal for our Vaal Regalia probably not high enough to warrant this.


If the orb can double as a regal, then and only then it would be awesomely OP for us:
create a +90 ES/9%attr chest. Buy a cheap 2nd chest with 100% ES. Use the orb. If the 100%ES transfers, instant awesome armor. If not, better luck next time.
Another way is to "rescue" a bad regal: same 90/9% chest as above after you regaled to a bad mod. You then try to annul the bad mod and succeed. Now you have a rare with low ES. To fix that you can try the awakener orb with the 100%ES donor chest from above.
The 2nd way is of course way more probable to actually work.

I think Awakener's Orbs are really going to come down to the chance of moving a mod over, at least for this build.

If you get a Shaper's Necromancer Silks or whatever, you could roll until you get %Increased Intelligence on it and no other mods. Then, Awakener Orb it and transfer it to a Vaal Regalia with good mod(s). Shaper Items as a whole are going to be rarer, so finding a Shaper's Vaal Regalia may not be trivial.

Whether or not this is going to be a good idea, price-wise, in the new league is going to depend on a couple of factors. It probably won't be, but it is a potential option for SSF.

This item is more of a buff for the builds that want Shaper+Elder mods on a single item. Not even just for the mod comboes, but also for stuff like Mark of the Shaper or Mark of the Elder

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HHLupus escribió:

Third new gem is blasphemy: 24% to curse against hexproof enemies and the biggie: +1 curses! Stun immunity we get from cyclone, +1 curses now from support gem.

Blasphemy is not a part of this build. We don't have the mana for it.

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All shaper and elder stuff will be (much) more expensive. That sucks royally for both Watchers Eye and Cyclopean coil. I expect prices to ~double for both. Maybe more at the start.

Uber Elder will be more rare. But we only need the regular Elder. I'm actually quite not sure that the regular Elder will be harder to find. You won't need to spawn and spread his influence to 20 maps anymore. There is a new map fragment set for him, and those fragments drop from his Guardians who spawn as map bosses in the maps with the new mod ('occupied by NNN'). So the Elder stuff may end up being more common than before. Buying fragments to get the Elder sounds like a good shortcut to me.

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Corrupting the belt will also be harder. We want to increase quality via catalyst for the belt to get more %int from corruption and more %allattr from the explicit. So now the belt has to be a perfect 15% explicit so we can get additional +3% %attr. The corruption has to be at least 5% for the same reason to get an improvement from catalysts at all.

Corruption will be the Gucci option. Catalyst should be the base option now. You get the extra Int from it, and then you can try corrupting things. This is definitely a buff. I imagine, Catalysts will be very common in this league.

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- No more 10-12% Inc Attr mod on Shaper Amu. But there is a new Catalyst crafting option that compensates for that.

No more 10-12% on chests either I think.

No, only the Amulet one was removed. Patch notes say nothing about the chest. It makes sense, because they are adding the jewelry (Catalyst) quality to compensate.

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Kelvynn escribió:

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HHLupus escribió:

Third new gem is blasphemy: 24% to curse against hexproof enemies and the biggie: +1 curses! Stun immunity we get from cyclone, +1 curses now from support gem.

Blasphemy is not a part of this build. We don't have the mana for it.

They mean Curse on Hit.

HHLupus, IMO the stun immunity from the ascendancy is too strong to change even if the +1 curse seems wasted, maybe an opportunity for a third curse like temp chains to be added for a 6 link chest. Edit: Temp chains would also increase the duration of enfeeble/frostbite, generally a defensive option. However, elemental weakness could be a significant DPS boost.

The awakened Spell Cascade support is the most underwhelming of the gems we use that has been released in terms that it is still a good choice for mapping/high movement bosses, but otherwise cold pen is still probably the preferred choice for bossing. However, it is interesting now that the spell cascade has increased spell dmg per quality which may offset the DPS you lose from the increased AoE from quality the non-awakened version has. (Reminder: Increased AoE technically reduces single target DPS because the area in which shards fall increases and thus chance to hit an enemy in the area decreases)

Although as pointed out I don't know if the cold pen trumps other awakened gems now or not with the more added damage. Someone would have to PoB that (too lazy because I don't expect to find any of these SSFHC haha).

tried now some blighted maps in std with best gear i have.

Also with 2500 int 11,5 k es 16 k with spell cascade and 20 k with cold pen i have no chance to do T14 maps. And its the same as i try to play with as much as towers as posible or some towers and killing mobs or only killing mobs.
At one point so at 20 sek there is no chance to kill fast enought.

So its not only a blight problem also with best gear i have no chance :-(

All other contend also uber atziri is doable with this gear but not blighted maps. I hate that.

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JSquare escribió:

HHLupus, IMO the stun immunity from the ascendancy is too strong to change

Exactly why I chose Occ. You are not always cycloning. Stun immunity is very useful.