[3.15] Crimson Bow Gladiator, RoA + Puncture | Pure Bleed Build | All Content | In-depth

I am planning out a Bow bleed Gladiator and was looking through the forums and poe.ninja for ideas.

Maybe someone here can answer a question for me, not sure how relevant it is to this exact build guide though.

I found that many people are using Farrul's Fur with this build, and I just can't think of a reason why Aspect of the Cat would be relevant enough to use the body armour slot for it.

Frenzy generation is taken care of with Outmatch and Outlast. Power Charges do absolutely nothing for us. And the crit chance from the Aspect is irrelevant too, they take Resolute Technique after all. Only the timed phasing, damage reduction and 10% attack speed is gained from it as far as I see.

Here are two examples:

https://poe.ninja/challenge/builds/char/920193/DagorP
https://poe.ninja/challenge/builds/char/wby87/wbypracticingawakener

I am just a bit confused, everything else they do is very logical, Pride and Malevolence through an Aul's Uprising makes sense and all other gear is nicely min-maxxed. Well, apart from one of them not using Ryslathas Coil for some reason.

As far as I see it, a rare body armour, or even Lioneye's Vision for a 7-linked Split Arrow, like many others use, would be the far superior choice.

Am I just missing a major upside Farruls Fur and Aspect of the Cat bring to a bleed bow glad?

Also, why would they go for the Intimidate on hit Watchers Eye mod? Intimidate has no effect at all on the bleed damage, right?

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dfda91 escribió:

Spoiler

Thanks for respone mate, i have another question, whats the difference of this passive chart against another like Mathil (i see many top dps at poe.ninja thats go to the right side without using Lioeneye fall). I want to focus on map speed and maybe delve, wont be the main char to do Uber elder and Sirius at lvl8 since i got already necromancer to do it.

What do you suggest or what changes would be good to make the build viable for that?

What makes you think it's not optimized for that already? No changes are required, for any content, really.

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Lakh escribió:

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1) Are bleeds affected by total physical damage reduction? My guess has been that the initial hit (to set the bleed scale) is affected but the bleed is not(?)

2) How about intimidate? I'd guess it's the same deal(?)

I'm comparing these two bows, my assumption is that T.P.D.R-reduction is not superior enough to make that weapon a surprise winner.

3) If we're being cheap & not using the exalt +physical%, there's no benefit in %bleed chance over 100%, correct? So it becomes a question of whether you prefer Blind for safety, or Impale for a tiny bit of extra long-lived-mob damage?

4) PoB's inaccuracies with bleed calculations... is it just Ryslatha's and bleeding does 100% more damage mod? i.e. can we just accept those two are 'always' better & otherwise regard PoB's calculation as an accurate guideline for better-versus-worse, even if it's not actually accurate? Or are there some non-binary affixes which stuff up scaling calculations?

5) I assume Maraketh bow is now our ideal base, assuming we can manage the dex.

And to DankawSL specifically - love your guides mate. I played a pathfinder version of your CA for the synthesis event (and discovered exactly why you recommended raider, but still loved it). They're better than strong builds - they're well constructed & explained builds.

1 and 2 - You're correct. They're useless for anything except for leech purposes.

3 - Nope, there's none. Impale doesn't interact with bleed. Blind is the best crafted mod in that case

4 - I recently mentioned exactly what's wrong with PoB. Calculation method is also extremely incorrect since it ignores attack speed, incorrect crit values, uses average damage instead average maximum damage. You can use it to compare builds with more or less decent accuracy.

5 - Imperial or Citadel are in my opinion the best bases. Spine bow also seems better than before imo. Decent chunk of Maraketh's minimum base damage is reduced by Ryslatha's coil. You would only use it for 10% MS which i don't think it's that important anymore.

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Mecielle escribió:

Spoiler

I am planning out a Bow bleed Gladiator and was looking through the forums and poe.ninja for ideas.

Maybe someone here can answer a question for me, not sure how relevant it is to this exact build guide though.

I found that many people are using Farrul's Fur with this build, and I just can't think of a reason why Aspect of the Cat would be relevant enough to use the body armour slot for it.

Frenzy generation is taken care of with Blood Rage, or even just Frenzy for single target. Power Charges do absolutely nothing for us. And the crit chance from the Aspect is irrelevant too, they take Resolute Technique after all. Only the timed phasing, damage reduction and 10% attack speed is gained from it as far as I see.

Here are two examples:

https://poe.ninja/challenge/builds/char/920193/DagorP
https://poe.ninja/challenge/builds/char/wby87/wbypracticingawakener

I am just a bit confused, everything else they do is very logical, Pride and Malevolence through an Aul's Uprising makes sense and all other gear is nicely min-maxxed. Well, apart from one of them not using Ryslathas Coil for some reason.

As far as I see it, a rare body armour, or even Lioneye's Vision for a 7-linked Split Arrow, like many others use, would be the far superior choice.

Am I just missing a major upside Farruls Fur and Aspect of the Cat bring to a bleed bow glad?

People use it only for frenzy charge generation, which is a waste. With RT the power charges don't matter at all. If someone uses it without RT, it makes much more sense. My build uses Farrul's Fur as well in end game version, but for one more reason which is abusing 2 bleed types for much higher damage output on bosses.

If someone doesn't use Ryslatha's it means he doesn't know it works with bleed. It's no-brainer for any bleed build.

Build's damage is high, you really don't need that 7-link to clear trash monsters. It's a waste of chest slot. I recommend RoA for end game anyway.

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DankawSL escribió:

People use it only for frenzy charge generation, which is a waste. With RT the power charges don't matter at all. If someone uses it without RT, it makes much more sense. My build uses Farrul's Fur as well in end game version, but for one more reason which is abusing 2 bleed types for much higher damage output on bosses.

If someone doesn't use Ryslatha's it means he doesn't know it works with bleed. It's no-brainer for any bleed build.

Build's damage is high, you really don't need that 7-link to clear trash monsters. It's a waste of chest slot. I recommend RoA for end game anyway.

You mean with Farruls Pounce, right? Have been thinking about that too, but sounds too complicated for my taste, switching between Crimson Dance and no Crimson Dance on a rotation. I guess you then also don't use RT to make use of the crits and massive Accuracy from the gloves?

I just find the thought of having to apply 8+1 bleeds on bosses, with a sluggish skill like Puncture, for slightly higher damage when compared to 1 bleed to be uncomfortable, so didn't plan to do any Crimson Dance action. I mean, the bosses where it counts have tons of phases, meaning I have to do at least 9 punctures everytime they phase... But maybe I'm wrong and it works well, guess I have to test it myself, because I plan to min-max the shit out of the build :D

And why do you prefer RoA over Split Arrow?

And you talk about your endgame version. Did I miss that in the guide?

And one additional question: Is there any reason to get Intimidate on hit for a bleed build? It doesn't scale the bleed or the explosions as far as I understand it.

why are you taking 2 handed melee nodes???

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eixxxu escribió:

why are you taking 2 handed melee nodes???

What nodes exactly do you mean???

If you mean the ones to the left side of the tree, those are converted to bow nodes mostly. With Lioneye's Fall. If you mean the ones in the duelist area, those still give ailment damage to bows.


And @OP:

I think the Warlord body armour suffix "Gain an Endurance Charge every second if you've been Hit Recently" is the better way to always keep us at max Endurance Charges. Not only does it also keep us at max charges during boss fights without adds, it also lets us focus on damage mods on the boots. The faster bleed from Hunter for example.

And if you check in, don't miss my post two comments above, really interested in some of the answers.

I've started levelling my own bleed char and currently i'm about to dive into maps. I used RoA all the way. I was worried it might have too low damage, but it's not the case honestly. After cruel lab it feels amazing. Very likely i'll completely switch the guide to RoA then and mention that Split Arrow can be used as alternative.

I'm also not a big fan of the newest build iteration. I liked old one more if you ask me. Bosses with a lot of adds (like metamorph) are problematic since puncture can be applied only one at a time... Fortunately Vaal RoA saves the day in most cases.

I'll play around bit more until i do the big update. Testing the build beforehand allows for better optimization.

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Mecielle escribió:

Spoiler

You mean with Farruls Pounce, right? Have been thinking about that too, but sounds too complicated for my taste, switching between Crimson Dance and no Crimson Dance on a rotation. I guess you then also don't use RT to make use of the crits and massive Accuracy from the gloves?

I just find the thought of having to apply 8+1 bleeds on bosses, with a sluggish skill like Puncture, for slightly higher damage when compared to 1 bleed to be uncomfortable, so didn't plan to do any Crimson Dance action. I mean, the bosses where it counts have tons of phases, meaning I have to do at least 9 punctures everytime they phase... But maybe I'm wrong and it works well, guess I have to test it myself, because I plan to min-max the shit out of the build :D

And why do you prefer RoA over Split Arrow?

And you talk about your endgame version. Did I miss that in the guide?

And one additional question: Is there any reason to get Intimidate on hit for a bleed build? It doesn't scale the bleed or the explosions as far as I understand it.

End game build can be found in progression section. The big update was done in hurry and i expected to make a clean up much earlier. This should answer all your questions except...

Intimidate. I literally just answered it in previous reply. No, it doesn't work.

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Mecielle escribió:

Spoiler

I think the Warlord body armour suffix "Gain an Endurance Charge every second if you've been Hit Recently" is the better way to always keep us at max Endurance Charges. Not only does it also keep us at max charges during boss fights without adds, it also lets us focus on damage mods on the boots. The faster bleed from Hunter for example.

And if you check in, don't miss my post two comments above, really interested in some of the answers.

You can't have everything. Every time you add something to the build it means you lose something as well.

If you're fighting a boss you don't want to get hit, so you should not rely on it in the first place. If you make use of it, there's high chance you're about to die anyway. Kintsugi/Loreweave offer better protection. Farrul's Fur offers higher damage and QoL in the fact you don't need to generate frenzy charges and focus on fighting the boss.

Hunter boots give only ~6-7% damage at best while being hard to craft. It's not worth it.

Just started craft the bow to try get better, i just made double T1 (32 to 72 physical Damage "Flaring" and 60% chance for bleeding deal 100%) after annul the crap mods, should i multicraft or i need atleast 3 good rolls? maybe hybrid slam posibility too?

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dfda91 escribió:

Just started craft the bow to try get better, i just made double T1 (32 to 72 physical Damage "Flaring" and 60% chance for bleeding deal 100%) after annul the crap mods, should i multicraft or i need atleast 3 good rolls? maybe hybrid slam posibility too?

T1 flat phys + the 100% more bleed dmg mod is the xact same thing i did. Here it is multimodded:



It divines to around 460 pDPS.

If you check the trade site for similar bows, they run around 20-25ex, so definitely don't slam. Multimod gives you an insanely viable endgame bow, even without the faster bleed mod.

If you really want that mod, just multi-mod this one and sell it. Then keep going with another base.

@OP: Maybe you miss all the little hits you take during bossfights, if you think that if you get hit you are dead...

Uber Elder, Shaper and Sirus, during all fights I was at 100% uptime of max endurance charges. If you think the "Endurance charge on kill" from the boots, which is 100% useless in boss fights, is better, well, I very much disagree.

But yea, I guess some of the unique ones can be good solutions too. But I honestly struggle to see how Kintsugi or Loreweave are viable options. We are already at 77,76,76 max res. Getting 78% doesn't add as much as it usually would. And damage and life wise it doesn't add much either. And I hate RNG defenses, so Kintsugi in my eyes is always worse than a high armour body armour that boosts my Vaal Molten Shell and can give a ton of life and resists, on top of utility.

But will definitely give Vaal RoA a try. Always loved the skill and really, its a small change to make.

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dfda91 escribió:

Just started craft the bow to try get better, i just made double T1 (32 to 72 physical Damage "Flaring" and 60% chance for bleeding deal 100%) after annul the crap mods, should i multicraft or i need atleast 3 good rolls? maybe hybrid slam posibility too?

To annul often means to lose the item. Assuming you have 2 prefixes so the third can be crafted, use "Prefixes cannot be changed" and scour. Then multicraft and slam for chance of rolling something good.

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Mecielle escribió:

Spoiler

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dfda91 escribió:

Just started craft the bow to try get better, i just made double T1 (32 to 72 physical Damage "Flaring" and 60% chance for bleeding deal 100%) after annul the crap mods, should i multicraft or i need atleast 3 good rolls? maybe hybrid slam posibility too?

T1 flat phys + the 100% more bleed dmg mod is the xact same thing i did. Here it is multimodded:

It divines to around 460 pDPS.

If you check the trade site for similar bows, they run around 20-25ex, so definitely don't slam. Multimod gives you an insanely viable endgame bow, even without the faster bleed mod.

If you really want that mod, just multi-mod this one and sell it. Then keep going with another base.

@OP: Maybe you miss all the little hits you take during bossfights, if you think that if you get hit you are dead...

Uber Elder, Shaper and Sirus, during all fights I was at 100% uptime of max endurance charges. If you think the "Endurance charge on kill" from the boots, which is 100% useless in boss fights, is better, well, I very much disagree.

But yea, I guess some of the unique ones can be good solutions too. But I honestly struggle to see how Kintsugi or Loreweave are viable options. We are already at 77,76,76 max res. Getting 78% doesn't add as much as it usually would. And damage and life wise it doesn't add much either. And I hate RNG defenses, so Kintsugi in my eyes is always worse than a high armour body armour that boosts my Vaal Molten Shell and can give a ton of life and resists, on top of utility.

But will definitely give Vaal RoA a try. Always loved the skill and really, its a small change to make.

You're wasting my time and your own. You're using COMPLETELY DIFFERENT defensive mechanic and make arguments based on it without even telling me about it right away. What you're saying is correct for armour, it's not exactly the case for evasion.

No, i don't like armour. Yes, you can use armour and abuse Molten Shell. I prefer evasion and dodge as a defensive mechanic and the guide will stay that way. Period.

There's nothing else for me to say until we get on equal footing from context perspective.

Whatever lol. You talk as if I suggested you change your build... Was just looking for some input because the exact version I play has no thread.

Btw, RoA feels quite nice. But not really sure yet. I think I still prefer Split Arrow with Awakaned Chain. Insane coverage, even in bad layouts, and almost triple the bleed damage, so stuff dies faster.

With RoA, even with fully awakaned supports, rares often survived quite long in max juiced and sextanted T16s. And while the area is ok, not everything inside the area is hit.