[3.3 Raider] Muirey's 2h Freezing Cyclone - Raider Edition!

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Muirey escribió:

If you want to wait, I am going to be putting the Slayer version of this build guide up in the next few days and then you can just read it all for yourself!

Thanks for detailed response.

I threw frostbite and I have to say trash mobs in up to t9 die instantly. Feels great with elem prolif.! I wouldnt change that gem out at all. Atm ~74k dps with flask.. not bad.

On the side note i might myself, but maybe its too much to do on my own but. What about LL slayer with this build?
LL for temp chains! Probably overkill but even for pvp it would be insane in theory.
enhance lvl 4 temp chains is already great but with chill it should be hype.
Also can put much more if LL not just temp chains. Mana reservation would be hard task to sort out curses and auras.
Im sure frostbite+temp chains would be epic.

I would like to have that in standard league such build.
If that is impossible then perhaps ranger would suit it better. But slayer ascendancy is really too good to pass up.


I will wait for proper slayer guide. Im in no rush since I already do decently in t10 or even t13 - I dont even have many red maps to complain about lack of damage.

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LuckHasFallen escribió:

I noticed most of the suggestive gear you posted has crit multi's, but if we're using RT then what do you suppose our other option is? Or did you have a crit version of the tree in mind? Also, Razor's edge is the only source giving us bleed, correct?

Not sure where you are seeing the crit multi, but they may just be found gear or was cheap and met other criteria. The guide covers the stat priority on each gear. For accessories and boots, focus on HP and resists, with other stuff like INT, WED, flat phys, and elemental dmg being bonuses. Once you start overcapping, then you can start replacing the HP/resist stuff with HP/dmg or unis like Daressos and Vector +2 frenzy.

For bleeding, if you're talking about Kondo's bonus then, yes. 15% from Razor's Edge and another 10% on the way. 25% is more than enough for that since you should only need it for rares and bosses that take longer to kill.

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I noticed most of the suggestive gear you posted has crit multi's, but if we're using RT then what do you suppose our other option is? Or did you have a crit version of the tree in mind?

The only things I can think of that have bonuses to crit on them are the helms other than Devoto's. Abyssus, Rat's Nest and Starkonjas all have some kind of crit on them but we're mainly using them for all the other bonuses they provide.

While it is possible to do a crit version of the build it would be rather... odd. You'd want to stay on the right side of the tree as much as possible which would cut out the really strong axe nodes on the right. So then maybe swords... but starforge cuts out all elemental damage and Kondo's punishes you for critting.

A dual wield style could do it or a one hand + Shield but that'd be a different build, which I might add, there is already! :D

It's also a pretty fun build at that. If you had a well crafted rare sword you could make it work but that's a lot of effort and getting a high pdps rare sword could be easy or very hard. So not that it can't be done, just that the effort kind of outweighs the benefits but hey If you're up to it go for it! That's how new builds get made!

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Also, Razor's edge is the only source giving us bleed, correct?

Correct, with how fast cyclone attacks more isn't 'that' necessary but using a chance to bleed support or picking up the Bloodletting wheel will give you more. Bleed isn't a huge part of the damage aside from the boost kondo's provides to damage against bleeding targets. Anything you hit for more than 2 seconds is going to be bleeding though.

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webas escribió:

Thanks for detailed response.

I threw frostbite and I have to say trash mobs in up to t9 die instantly. Feels great with elem prolif.! I wouldnt change that gem out at all. Atm ~74k dps with flask.. not bad.

Not a problem. Yeah if you like Ele prolif by all means keep using it. It is fun, I just prefer it on totem instead of main cyclone setup but to each their own.

74k is definitely low. I'm 6 levels under you on my slayer and my tooltip alone in hideout is 105K. I think PoB put me around 470k ish. That's with ele focus but I believe with 20/20 maim it was 430k or some such. Only flasks I have are Atziri's promise and a sulfur flask.

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On the side note i might myself, but maybe its too much to do on my own but. What about LL slayer with this build?
LL for temp chains! Probably overkill but even for pvp it would be insane in theory.
enhance lvl 4 temp chains is already great but with chill it should be hype.
Also can put much more if LL not just temp chains. Mana reservation would be hard task to sort out curses and auras.
Im sure frostbite+temp chains would be epic.

I have no clue about PoE PvP and probably never will, so I'm not quite sure what it is you are referring to.

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I would like to have that in standard league such build.
If that is impossible then perhaps ranger would suit it better. But slayer ascendancy is really too good to pass up.


I will wait for proper slayer guide. Im in no rush since I already do decently in t10 or even t13 - I dont even have many red maps to complain about lack of damage.

Slayer Ascendancy is very good. I go back and forth between my Ranger/Duelist because they are both fun to play.

One thing I was talking to someone about in game last week was about running the build as Pathfinder. Hadn't thought about it but after having the conversation and looking into it I'm going to have to make a run of it to see.

Swapped Devoto's to Lightpoacher with 15% IAS Cyclone enchant. Cost a hell of a lot less than the same enchant on a Devotos. The only thing I miss is the movement speed buff from Devotos.

Darkray Boots I used for a bit, but I honestly hated being so slow, especially when I had to backtrack.

Would like to get opinions on my equipment; looking to get insight as to the next big investment (maybe improve upon my jewels, but not too sure what the best DPS stats I should aim for). I'm sitting at 4.8k HP. Each level up from this point onward goes into increasing maximum life.

Guys..I'm reading the last two pages of comments and I'm convinced I'm doing something wrong. I seen you guys talking about 70k and 100k dps in h/o..Mines at 27k lol. I can kill trash mobs so fast. Up to T12 with 2 people I can clear trash mobs and rares/elites. I know my life is still low, 4k, I have a 6 socket belly I'm trying to link. But my 27k dps in h/o compared to your 100k.. Wtf am I doing wrong. I would appreciate some help.

I'm loving the build btw.
Cheers.

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ZhaQar escribió:

Would like to get opinions on my equipment; looking to get insight as to the next big investment (maybe improve upon my jewels, but not too sure what the best DPS stats I should aim for). I'm sitting at 4.8k HP. Each level up from this point onward goes into increasing maximum life.

Definitely better Jewels would be the first thing I upgrade. Every 35 HP on an Abyss Jewel or 6% on regular Jewel is about 100 HP. I count 3 Jewels missing HP plus there is a 2-point Jewel socket above Juggernaut for ~400 HP more and more dmg. Your DPS is going to go down a bit, but that extra HP will go a long a way.

Boot upgrade - same or more resists, 30% movement speed, and possibly better enchants run 10c to 3 ex depending on the rolls and enchant.

Flasks - Sin's Rebirth and Taste of Hate are some big, expensive upgrades to work towards.

You can also start building up your 21/20 gems as well for roughly 1-2 ex each.

Rings - Could get WED and/or more phys dmg, but going to be hella expensive to balance resists with all those uniques and DPS heavy fort belt.

Speaking of belt, I'm curious if you can master craft that belt? Ignoring the current craft, the last 3 are all Shaped mods. So without the current craft, there is only life and cold resist on that belt, so maybe you can master craft WED and another resist? Then you can relieve a resist on a ring and get something with WED.

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Muirey escribió:

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I noticed most of the suggestive gear you posted has crit multi's, but if we're using RT then what do you suppose our other option is? Or did you have a crit version of the tree in mind?

The only things I can think of that have bonuses to crit on them are the helms other than Devoto's. Abyssus, Rat's Nest and Starkonjas all have some kind of crit on them but we're mainly using them for all the other bonuses they provide.

While it is possible to do a crit version of the build it would be rather... odd. You'd want to stay on the right side of the tree as much as possible which would cut out the really strong axe nodes on the right. So then maybe swords... but starforge cuts out all elemental damage and Kondo's punishes you for critting.

A dual wield style could do it or a one hand + Shield but that'd be a different build, which I might add, there is already! :D

It's also a pretty fun build at that. If you had a well crafted rare sword you could make it work but that's a lot of effort and getting a high pdps rare sword could be easy or very hard. So not that it can't be done, just that the effort kind of outweighs the benefits but hey If you're up to it go for it! That's how new builds get made!

"

Also, Razor's edge is the only source giving us bleed, correct?

Correct, with how fast cyclone attacks more isn't 'that' necessary but using a chance to bleed support or picking up the Bloodletting wheel will give you more. Bleed isn't a huge part of the damage aside from the boost kondo's provides to damage against bleeding targets. Anything you hit for more than 2 seconds is going to be bleeding though.

I appreciate the fast response, my next question is do you think having a 6L rare over a 5L carass jack is more better for my cyclone with my gear at the moment? I'm considering on what to upgrade next with what I have.

Also, what flasks do you recommend I should be looking out for? I noticed you listed some flasks, but didn't give any explanation.

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zKronos escribió:

Guys..I'm reading the last two pages of comments and I'm convinced I'm doing something wrong. I seen you guys talking about 70k and 100k dps in h/o..Mines at 27k lol.

H/O DPS usually includes auras as well, so make sure Hatred is on in comparison. You are also using Hypothermia and Carnage Heart, which there is nothing wrong, but the extra dmh only works while they are chilled or while leeching, so less H/O dmg than someone using Elemental Focus, for example.

20% on core Cyclone links will add a lot of damage on each gem, and you'll get those with the level 20 vendor recipe and level them back up. 10% physical, 10% dmg on full life, and 10% WED.
Ventor rings and belt adds no DPS. Just life and resist. Rare rings and belt with life, resists, and physical or WED (ideally both, but crazy expensive).
Upgrade your flasks. You have no way to remove bleed and shouldn't need a mana flask or 2nd HP. Get stuff like Lion's Roar, Sulphur, or defensive flasks.
All around jewel upgrades. Fertile Mind in top right jewel socket and see guide for what kind of jewels to get in the rest of your slots. Every Jewel should have + life or +% life or you're reducing your HP by ~100. The one near Barbarism is just adding ~75 HP and 14% light resist, but no dmg.
Swap the 3 points going up from Resolute to either Blade Master or Razor's edge. I'd also trade Executioner for the other one you didn't take. Razor's Edge adds range and bleeding for Kondo while Blade Master adds a lot of dmg.

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ZhaQar escribió:

Swapped Devoto's to Lightpoacher with 15% IAS Cyclone enchant. Cost a hell of a lot less than the same enchant on a Devotos. The only thing I miss is the movement speed buff from Devotos.

Darkray Boots I used for a bit, but I honestly hated being so slow, especially when I had to backtrack.

Would like to get opinions on my equipment; looking to get insight as to the next big investment (maybe improve upon my jewels, but not too sure what the best DPS stats I should aim for). I'm sitting at 4.8k HP. Each level up from this point onward goes into increasing maximum life.

Lightpoachers are pretty hilarious and you should enjoy them... who knows how long it'll last! :D

Darkrays I only really use for big bosses where you're going to be spinning in circles around them with max frenzy for awhile. Mapping it's good once it's started but, as you said, horrible if you have to back track.

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blackdeath101 escribió:

Definitely better Jewels would be the first thing I upgrade. Every 35 HP on an Abyss Jewel or 6% on regular Jewel is about 100 HP. I count 3 Jewels missing HP plus there is a 2-point Jewel socket above Juggernaut for ~400 HP more and more dmg. Your DPS is going to go down a bit, but that extra HP will go a long a way.

Boot upgrade - same or more resists, 30% movement speed, and possibly better enchants run 10c to 3 ex depending on the rolls and enchant.

Flasks - Sin's Rebirth and Taste of Hate are some big, expensive upgrades to work towards.

You can also start building up your 21/20 gems as well for roughly 1-2 ex each.

Rings - Could get WED and/or more phys dmg, but going to be hella expensive to balance resists with all those uniques and DPS heavy fort belt.

Ditto what Blackdeath101 says. Only thing to add on rings is Opals but that is really END END upgrading because it's best to craft your own and that could be cheap or super expensive.

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zKronos escribió:

Guys..I'm reading the last two pages of comments and I'm convinced I'm doing something wrong. I seen you guys talking about 70k and 100k dps in h/o..Mines at 27k lol. I can kill trash mobs so fast. Up to T12 with 2 people I can clear trash mobs and rares/elites. I know my life is still low, 4k, I have a 6 socket belly I'm trying to link. But my 27k dps in h/o compared to your 100k.. Wtf am I doing wrong. I would appreciate some help.

I'm loving the build btw.
Cheers.

Thanks, glad you're enjoying it! Let's see what's going on.

Gear and links all look fine but when I was mentioning dps numbers I was speaking of a few different things.

1) My slayer
2) Using Ele focus or Maim instead of Hypothermia.

Hypo won't show in hideout so your tooltip will be lower but Hypo is higher dmg if target is chilled than Maim. Ele focus + Conc effect is the ego stroking leaned back in your chair 250k tooltip dps mode.

As for passive tree I would make just a few changes..

www.poeurl.com/bJuo

You need some kind of bleed chance for kondo's so picking up razors edge would boost your dps while on bosses nicely. If you have culling in totem setup then you can wait to get Executioner for later. Most t15 and lower bosses won't be low life but greater than 10% for culling long enough for it to matter. Other nodes will serve you better for now.

There a reason you decided to head up towards Devotion instead of toward Constitution as the passive tree suggests?

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LuckHasFallen escribió:

I appreciate the fast response, my next question is do you think having a 6L rare over a 5L carass jack is more better for my cyclone with my gear at the moment? I'm considering on what to upgrade next with what I have.

Also, what flasks do you recommend I should be looking out for? I noticed you listed some flasks, but didn't give any explanation.

Depending on your current currency... If I was at that point I'd get a cheap Carcass Jack and 4l it and Kondo. If you have more Chaos available either buying a 5l Carcass or jeweller's touch prophecy.

If you have even more Chaos... 50ish you could quickly 5l Kondo's and Carcass Jack. That would be a good base and the Carcass Jack you'll swap between forever.

Atziri's promise is always cheap and a pretty good dps/survival flask. Others kind of depend on where you are. Taste/Sin's/Lion's are kind of the 'I have enough currency so may as well buy it' things. You don't need them but hey why not have them!

I will add an explanation on flasks to the main guide but until then...

Taste of Hate: Big Damage boost and physical mitigation by converting phys to cold.

Sin's Rebirth: Big Damage and chaos damage at that which is very nice. Smoke cloud is a very good thing to drop on a boss to keep them blinding and not punching your face in.

Lion's Roar: Mainly damage. The weakest of the three and only for bosses that can't be knocked back OR if a boss is super annoying and you want to move it way the fuck away from everything else. Aside from that the knockback can be annoying when using cyclone.

Other than those three, a curse immune quicksilver I what I run after full Ascendancy but before that freeze immune. One life flask with bleed removal/immunity is the other one I use unless running with Death's Door. It could be another type of flask but I don't use life flasks that often and when I have bleed stacks I want that flask to have charges or else I'm D-E-A-D! ;)