[3.0] NeverSink's ♣ INDEPTH Tornado&Archer Guide ♣ Beginner friendly ♣ Rapid clear ♣ All bosses

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Akalamiammiam escribió:
Yeah I have a really crappy weapon, but since it's my first char', I don't have any leveling items..


Use Rustic Sash (blue, sometimes - yellow) to craft a new weapon from time to time. Still, if you keep much higher level than monsters, you'll have "reduced" damage (due to your damage being tied to item instead of gem). That's probably a Hardcore issue, because in softcore leagues bows outdamage spells easily while leveling.
IGN: MortalKombat
Molten Strike build guide: https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1346504

There is no knowledge
That is not power
Editado por útlima vez por MortalKombat3#6961 en 14 sept. 2014 23:06:14
@People having mana issues while leveling:
Option A: Skill Revelry. No Mana issues ever until you spec out of it later when you get an item with manaleech.
Option B: Get Elreon Jewelry with -skillcost, also no mana issue ever until you link a lot of supports.
After running Tornado Shot for a while, i have few questions - why use Pierce gem at all? Tornado Shot seems pretty solid without it, due to 100% pierce from initial shot, and pierce gem doesnt add really much. Maybe, it's justified with Drillneck (as additional damage boost), but what if i choose to use a rare quiver?
On other hand, though, there aint much choice for 6-L, Added fire damage, Increased Critical Strikes, Weapon Elemental Damage arent that great either....
And what about Pierce for Puncture? Is it because you want to hit the boss no matter of surrounding minions?

And the last - how are we supposed to do Vorici's quest "kill the target, leave all guards alive"?
IGN: MortalKombat
Molten Strike build guide: https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1346504

There is no knowledge
That is not power
Editado por útlima vez por MortalKombat3#6961 en 15 sept. 2014 5:39:41
I reworked big portions of the guide. Also added a leveling section and advice for atziri and uber-atziri. Also FANCY PICTURES. Finally!

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PedrinTornado escribió:
Hi!

First, thanks for this awesome build!

Im pretty new at the game, and some ppl said to me that this is a cheap and strong build, soo I'm doing it!

I'm lvl 25 by now, and I'm feeling some mana problems, I'm always out of mana.

I have already invest all my money in the gems and the death harp bow.

Do you have some lvling advices talking about mana?

Thanks soo much!


English isnt my first language, sorry for gramatic mistakes.

Bye.


I added a leveling chapter on the front page today. Please check it out :). Feel free to ask again, if some questions are not answered.

"
Just had some things I'd like to mention based on me playing Tornado Shot myself without looking at any builds. Up to 16-17k dps with charges up just before resetting my crit multi gem to 1/20.

I have been using Puncture forever and just decided that I wanted to forgo it, since realistically even in the best case it barely outdamages Tornado Shot. Your screenshot shows Puncture at 32k dps and Tornado at 17k. If 3 arrows per Tornado Shot hit an enemy, you're doing 51k. Because only about 2/3-3/4 of Puncture's damage is actually physical. and enemies take around 150% of that damage per second while walking, you're looking at maybe 60-70k dps with Puncture, and it's only useful on single targets, which doesn't really cut it for me.

Instead I replaced it with the following 5L:

Frenzy - GMP - Chain - Curse on Hit - Assassin's Mark

With a high level/quality Curse on Hit, you're actually getting a pretty big bonus to Assassin's Mark effectiveness. My end goal is to actually find an amulet with a high crit multi roll, high life roll, and corrupted with +1 max curses, in which case I'll run Rain of Arrows - Curse on Hit - Poacher's Mark - Assassin's Mark - Increased AoE as a 5L instead. This does a very good job at just replacing me needing to cast curses, and really adds to your damage by giving you 15% increased attack speed from the Frenzy charges.

I also want to say I don't like killing all the bandits in Merciless. Helping Alira gives +50% crit as long as you can sustain your charges. I find it hard to justify skipping that that in favor of a +20% crit bow node that you are currently using. Sure, you can argue you can't sustain charges in certain situations, but I wouldn't consider that 20% crit chance a big dealbreaker and the power charge I think is overall just a much bigger bonus.

Also, I'm not really a fan of Drillneck in general. I'm pretty sure you get more damage out of a well rolled Spike-Point (crit multi, attack speed, accuracy or crit chance), and it can give more life. Even assuming you're building to have 100% pierce chance, I'm not sure Drillneck outdamages a good spike-point, and I'm not sure that Pierce in general is more useful to have than say Added Fire Damage.

After looking at your build, I'm definitely going to respec soon to get more life. I realized that going through Aspect of Eagle isn't actually all that great, so I'm planning to respec that area to go towards Scion life wheel (and connect to the Scion evasion wheel to save a few more points). I do a lot of magic finding, so I am often using Aurseize and IIR neck/rings, which means I don't have access to mana leech on gear. Outside of the mana leech I like Maligaro's more than the Rampage league specific gloves anyways. Both of these factors means that I think Mind Drinker is really nice. Likewise, to ease up on gear requirements, I find Weathered Hunter really useful (and it's easy to respec once your jewelry is good enough, though still might be needed for MFing).


Some very solid ideas here

1) I added the "utility shot" option to the guide. It's a viable alternative to Puncture. However, I'll likely stick to puncture becasue:
-it helps so much during certain master missions (hello vorici)
-it helps against reflect
-it's vital for the trio and atziri
-the knockback from crits pushes targets around, causing them to take damage from puncture. Also my puncture is 5-linked, while my TS is 6-linked. A 6-linked Puncture should have 40k++ DPS with my (good, but not amazing) equip.
-It also produces amazing results with HoA+Elemental Proliferation if you want to run it instead of HoI.
2) Bandit rewards - Also added it to the guide. It's a viable options, especially if you want to run a utility shot or a PCoC
3) I did a lot of testing with drillneck. I also noted in the guide that tooltip-wise drillneck is weaker than a awesome spike-point. However, it really does a lot for the AOE clear. While the TS damage of a spike point might be higher, the numerous pierces, hit a lot more targets, resulting in a significantly faster AOE clear. Also you keep killing off-screen mobs a lot more. The result is less shots fired to kill a group. However, it's absolutely viable to run a non-drillneck build, also easier to cap leech, resistances and helps with life.
4) Using mind-drinker is not a horrible mistake, obviously finding the right jewelry is hard. Still if you manage to refund those 3 nodes, it's quite a big difference and usually very well worth the 1 affix.

Thanks for the advice and the useful feedback

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Got a question, at what point are we ready to do normal Atziri? What level and gear we looking at?


Added a section for that in the guide. Check it out.

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I decided to give this build a try, too.
Usually, when i look at skilltree build in some guide, i see some ways to optimize it and make it better. This really discorages fro playing that build, though, as it reveal, that its author isnt a good buildmaker really.
In this case, the only "flaw" was 40% pierce from tree, when 30% is totally enough (with leveled/quality enough gem), and 10% projectile damage isnt worth 2 nodes (8% projectile damage for 1 node instead is much better). And, maybe, skip Quickstep cluster for extra +10% increased maximum life" or "Master fletcher".
Compared to other skilltrees, this really shines. Also i like your intent to use crits (good DPS), evasion/ondar's guile to counter reflect and ranged attackers, while using knockback against melee ones, pierce for AoE (no damn blood magic), etc.
You're absolutely right - build, that realies upon too few defences, fails. I will add to this - build, that deals too little DPS, fails too, and at last, build, that is vulnerable to desync, also fails. Yours is obviously none of those.


Thanks for pointing out the pierce-node problem. I fixed it and added some more information for standard/pierce/non-pierce build variations.

Also added a FAQ entry for quickstep.

Thank you.

"
Starting my first Beyond character today and will use this build, because I never played bows build (except an Explosion Arrow build, but that's not "really" a bow build) and it seems great for HC.
Compared to my usual casters, it's slow at the beginning, and mana is a problem, but I hope it will get better&better..


It does get better, I added a leveling section. You might want to check it out. Good luck.

"

After running Tornado Shot for a while, i have few questions - why use Pierce gem at all? Tornado Shot seems pretty solid without it, due to 100% pierce from initial shot, and pierce gem doesnt add really much. Maybe, it's justified with Drillneck (as additional damage boost), but what if i choose to use a rare quiver?
On other hand, though, there aint much choice for 6-L, Added fire damage, Increased Critical Strikes, Weapon Elemental Damage arent that great either....
And what about Pierce for Puncture? Is it because you want to hit the boss no matter of surrounding minions?

And the last - how are we supposed to do Vorici's quest "kill the target, leave all guards alive"?


As pointed out in the guide, you ONLY want to use the pierce GEM (you can use the nodes, without drillneck if you want) if you have drillneck-quiver. With drillneck and a quality pierce gem, you combine a 70%+ damage increase with the functionality of pierce.

That means:
1) Tornado shot cluster arrows hit harder and pierce enemies allowing for a much faster and less random AOE clear
2) Puncture arrows hit the intended target in hordes much easier allowing us to snipe targets and take down other enemies at the same time. Also hilarious for doorways.

As for vorici:

It's hard to do it.

You should try pulling away most guards or the exile and proceed puncturing the exile once you have the chance. Once you have clear line of sight a single puncture crit can kill the exile, with OK-ish equipment.

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Once again, thanks everyone for the feedback.

I also updated the guide, if you have any feedback/advice/find any mistakes please contact me or post here.
Please don't PM me ingame with filter/guide questions, post them on the forum, after reading the FAQ.
Editado por útlima vez por NeverSink#3349 en 15 sept. 2014 6:44:47
Ok now that i've capped Resist + 2% Mana Leech and 108 INT / 109 STR...and raised a bit more the HP....i have lost tons of Dmg.... 6k+ on Puncture and 4k+ on Tornado Shot.

My Gear:
Spoiler


My Skill Tree at Lvl 86:



Problems Now:

-Only 3.6k Life
-22k Pucture dmg / 12k Tornado Shot dmg (-5~6k than b4)


Looking for:

-Recover the dmg lost
-More HP (4k is enough)
Editado por útlima vez por RidoBoss#4057 en 15 sept. 2014 7:52:55
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Y0UR escribió:

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Once again, thanks everyone for the feedback.

I also updated the guide, if you have any feedback/advice/find any mistakes please contact me or post here.



Thank you for feedback too.

Another few questions there:
1. Is Herald of Ice worth using at all? I actually find it being a very small damage boost, isnt it better to link Herald of Ash to Elemental Proliferation and Increased Burning Damage. And that's more free mana left.
2. Do you think "Revenge of the hunted" notable worth 5 points invested? That's actually 12% damage, 12% life and 38% evasion, but you could get 25% life from Scion cluster instead, for example, or Heavy Draw (+69% damage) and 5% life (i think realistically - build should be finished at no more than 110 skillpoints, better - at 105).
3. Is Ranged Attack Totem worth using?

A few hints to improve your guide:
1. Because you use evasion to counter reflect, there is a certain accuracy/evasion ratio you can have to maintain 95% chance to evade your own projectiles (reflect). Increasing accuracy/evasion higher may have unwanted drawbacks because of reflect.
A link to accuracy formula (so you can make the math) - http://pathofexile.gamepedia.com/Accuracy

2. Evasion not only allows you (and your enemies!) to avoid attacks completely, but to avoid critical strikes as well (if attack hits) - the another independent accuracy roll is made in such a case, and if it fails, then "would-be critical strike" is downgraded to a normal hit.
Source - http://pathofexile.gamepedia.com/Evasion
The good new are - even if you hit yourself (due to reflect), your attack will most probbly be downgraded to a normal hit (which doesnt really hurt). The bad news are - if you have too low accuracy, your "real" critical chance will be drastically reduced due to "double dibs".
IGN: MortalKombat
Molten Strike build guide: https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1346504

There is no knowledge
That is not power
Editado por útlima vez por MortalKombat3#6961 en 16 sept. 2014 4:10:00
Probably the most fun I've had in a while, I sold most of my fortunes to get the gear below and try out your build. I am slowly migrating over from a "Freeze the Screen" build, and ended up putting TS in a Range Attack Totem to level it up.

Spoiler



I had a lot of mana issues during the transition. I tried boosting mana%/Mana Regen nodes from the tree, till I figured out that all that is needed is Mind Drinker 2% mana leech. The hook is, is that the better your accuracy, the better the mana leech works (similar to how your crit dps scales with the extra successful hits). Running a Surgeons Hybrid Flask fills any rare gaps when out-of-mana and shooting blanks.

TS in my Attack Range totem with Blind and GMP is working very well. I'm not sure how I can let go of Ice Shot, the way it rips through enemies right now, but I will give it a fair assessment.

I have to say, Victario's Acuity and Daresso's defiance is a sick combo for maintaining 3 End, 4 Frenzy, 4 Power Charges. Thankfully my belt maxes my resists, and I still have over 4100 hp.

My old Tree:

I just wanted to also mention that I thought your video was great, and your skill belies how easy you made it look. I learned a lot. Thanks for the time on the build.
IGN: Grave_Intentions
$$$ Grave Intentions Flame Totem MFarmer: I'm Cheap 'n' Easy $$$
http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/979802
Editado por útlima vez por Fri3dchick3m#5883 en 15 sept. 2014 16:11:49
Mana per kill / hit is better than maximum mana and mana regen rate?

Thanks.
Should I get avatar of the hunt for extra damage ?
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PedrinTornado escribió:
Mana per kill / hit is better than maximum mana and mana regen rate?

Thanks.
i dumped about 10 passive points into it and the regen was still not great. Bigger mana pool and less OOM states, but it didn't solve my root issue. The 10 passives filled out my defensives and now I am allocating points to damage.

The only cost was having to use a flask when I use too many auxiliary skills in a row
IGN: Grave_Intentions
$$$ Grave Intentions Flame Totem MFarmer: I'm Cheap 'n' Easy $$$
http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/979802

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